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 Post subject: eddie van halen and tapping
PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 1:04 pm 
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ok i know this has been discussed nineteen thousand times, and we've read it everywhere. randy rhoads admired EVH. he said he didnt want to get close to competing on the same level with players like eddie.
maybe, im completely oblivious, but randy rhoads was ahead of his time just as EVH was. like what i dont get is when ya think of EVH you think of tapping. its like hes been shoved inside this labelled box. its almost like eddie only had tapping going for him. like hendrix before him, he turned guitar playing upside down and gave it a good kick. but is that all we ever could expect out of EVH? tapping? i read that john lennon was the first person to ever use feedback in a guitar solo. eddie certainly wasnt the first to use tapping. i remember someone on here before said ace frehley was tapping as early as 1976.
i think what im trying to say here is that you think of evh. you think of tapping. and most pics of him hes playing a tapped solo or whatnot.

we've read that EVH was the king of tapping and randy rhoads was not far behind him when it came to tapping. but i believe that randy rhoads was just as big as an influence in the guitar world as eddie was. randy IMO took guitar solos to the next level. i mean listen to the over the mountain solo and think that that was in 1981. almost 30 years ago. i cant imagine what it must of been like discovering randy rhoads back in 1981. some of you guys on here obviously have amazing memories of randy when he was alive. i know the first time i heard randy rhoads playing i believe it was "believer" the first song i heard. knocked my teeth out!
still kicks my ass everytime i hear that riff.
what will be EVHS legacy? tapping? whats ur ideas guys? this is not a evh versus RR thread. im not trying to compare them at all. im just curious as to what all your guys and girls ideas are. if you can see what im trying to say. i dont wanna sound likeim saying EVH wasnt influential. you cant deny his place in the guitar world.

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 Post subject: Re: eddie van halen and tapping
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 11:06 am 
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22 views no replies......ah well

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 Post subject: Re: eddie van halen and tapping
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 5:00 pm 
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I know you said it won't be a comparison, but I have to bring up I think the 2 really go back to the apples and oranges thing for a point of reference in individuality. Eddie's legacy is in his unique playing style. I really wouldn't want to hear Randy playing "I'm the One" or "Take your Whiskey Home," just the same as I don't want to hear Ed trying to play Revelation or Tonight. Eddie was a much more lose dirty player, which often times I'm in the mood for, and Randy was a lot more structured, but still had that out of control tone/fills that guys like say Petrucci or Syn Gates don't have because they're a bit too clean at times for my liking. It's all a matter of taste really but I'd say to answer your question they utilize tapping differently. Eddie used tapping to fill in the gaps and integrated it between phrases often. Randy structured it a bit more as his solos were more like compositions. That's why I like solos like Crowley and Steal Away because it sounded like he could practically impovise what seemed real time composing on the spot to make the solo have a sense of direction. Eddie's solos often didn't have that same sense of direction which is why I think he said "jump" was one of his favorite solos in an interview once.


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 Post subject: Re: eddie van halen and tapping
PostPosted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 8:41 am 
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Just to ad a little wood to the fire I think EVH said that Jimmy Page's quick hammer ons and pull offs were his inspiration - But I think Page was also was a tapping pioneer. It seems like every time a guitar player is known for some "style" or "thing" or "gimmick" there's always some guy that did it like a year before him :P

according to Wikipedia, tapping techniques had been around since forever, but for the purpose of this arugment,

Quote:
" Various other guitarists such as Frank Zappa, Billy Gibbons from ZZ Top, Brian May from Queen, Duane Allman[4] from The Allman Brothers Band, and Leslie West from Mountain were using the tapping technique in the early 1970s as well. Ace Frehley and Frank Zappa used a guitar pick for their style of tapping. "
.

It seems that EVH did tapping like masturbation, and Randy implemented it with more purpose. Randy also did things with triads that were very "tap-esque" but never full on tapping. Like the first bar of the 2nd solo in Mr. Crowley.


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 Post subject: Re: eddie van halen and tapping
PostPosted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 8:00 pm 
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Ace did it as far back as 75.. that must mean Eddie copied him! BLASPHEMY!! :lol:

Tapping = overrated. Yeah it sounds cool, but it can make the shittiest guitar player thnk they know what they are doing since its so easy to do. Eddie made it popular and in return we got countless hairbands that had guitar solos littered with tapping.

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 Post subject: Re: eddie van halen and tapping
PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:20 pm 
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ibanez122 wrote:
Ace did it as far back as 75.. that must mean Eddie copied him! BLASPHEMY!! :lol:

Tapping = overrated. Yeah it sounds cool, but it can make the shittiest guitar player thnk they know what they are doing since its so easy to do. Eddie made it popular and in return we got countless hairbands that had guitar solos littered with tapping.


+1

my feeling towards tapping is to use it in a smaller scale, not a 20min tapping spotlight solo.


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 Post subject: Re: eddie van halen and tapping
PostPosted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:51 am 
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For the record Rory Gallagher was also tapping before Eddie Van Halen. It was a dumb myth that seemed to endure for decades, but I think it's pretty easy now days to get people to accept that Eddie just did not invent the technique. He definitely popularised it, and it's arguable that he perfected it, but there were people tapping hundreds, or thousands of years before Eddie.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNwXCqNTEQA

Go to 2.25 for Rory tapping in 1973, when Eddie was a mere, 18?


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 Post subject: Re: eddie van halen and tapping
PostPosted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 10:44 pm 
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The point that is often missed (in my humble opinion) when discussing the origin of tapping, is it's exact definition - and also the breadth of the term in the sense of it's definition.
(For example; In a similar vein to this argument, Chet Atkins did 'sweeping' before Malmsteen- and to get really 'pinicky' Villa Lobos did it before that almost 50 years earlier! In short we can split hairs and go back and back; however it was Malmsteen who utilised the technique as a part of his musical language)

In light of that, in a literal sense, I agree, it is inaccurate to say Van Halen 'invented' tapping, but I think it is fair to say that he was the first guitarist to create an entire musical language out of it. So you could say he invented the language/communication of it.
The way Eddie Van Halen took this technique (only touched upon by some of the musicians mentioned above) and revolutionalised it, makes him one of the most important figures in rock guitar history.

And for the record, Van Halen's music screams annoying cock rock to me LOL, so I am far from a fan...(there are a few songs I like though).

Matt

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 Post subject: Re: eddie van halen and tapping
PostPosted: Sat Jul 31, 2010 11:22 am 
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Sear wrote:
The point that is often missed (in my humble opinion) when discussing the origin of tapping, is it's exact definition - and also the breadth of the term in the sense of it's definition.
(For example; In a similar vein to this argument, Chet Atkins did 'sweeping' before Malmsteen- and to get really 'pinicky' Villa Lobos did it before that almost 50 years earlier! In short we can split hairs and go back and back; however it was Malmsteen who utilised the technique as a part of his musical language)

In light of that, in a literal sense, I agree, it is inaccurate to say Van Halen 'invented' tapping, but I think it is fair to say that he was the first guitarist to create an entire musical language out of it. So you could say he invented the language/communication of it.
The way Eddie Van Halen took this technique (only touched upon by some of the musicians mentioned above) and revolutionalised it, makes him one of the most important figures in rock guitar history.

And for the record, Van Halen's music screams annoying cock rock to me LOL, so I am far from a fan...(there are a few songs I like though).

Matt


Good post Matt. In agreement all the way. Their debut album still kicks like a mule though.


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 Post subject: Re: eddie van halen and tapping
PostPosted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 3:14 pm 
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I think Matt nailed the answer.


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 Post subject: Re: eddie van halen and tapping
PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 12:43 pm 
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all excellent replies guys. i learned alot!
wikipedia. gotta love it. but ya know. for all the ego thats gone to eddies head. the hell with him.

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